Dedicating this thread to Split Cue (yeah baby!)
www.scratchlive.net
www.scratchlive.net

Personally I would like to see split cue exactly as it is on the the 24z rane.com


But if we can get a firmware update...
www.scratchlive.net



Split Cue is the Master summed to mono in the right headphone. And signal from the cue fader summed to mono in the left headphone.

I like the idea of a two second hold to switch into split cue mode better then cycling through each one. Maybe even make the LED flicker when in split cue, maybe not.

Personally I think I would use Split Cue exclusively. Im already accustom to the one phone on, one phone off look. (sexy)

What do you guys think?
How should it work for a firmware update?

[Maury Finkle] do it, do it [/Maury Finkle]

All in favor say aye ....

AYE !!

and just because I like to complicate the issue:


[complication]
um yes, just to confuse the issue of course:
I don't think the one button is enough for this, but I would really like to be able to monitor the AUX IN. I would have the sound man send me whats going to the house into my AUX IN so that I could monitor EVERYTHING including the mic cupping rapper through my headphones. Yes I would need a mute for the AUX OUT. Better yet I would like to see a whole separate input for monitoring the house. And I would like it to split too. Maybe not enough DJs need a feature like this, but I do.
[/complication]

AYE!

i thought this was in the works already?

Interesting idea, this would be technically possible using one of the main channel inputs, just a question of finding a way to control it.

Co-signing.

sept, how would you switch it on, say it were coming in the AUX IN? cycling through 3, but not 4.

also we would need to a good way keeping from any possibility of feedback. It would be hard enough to convince the soundman to plug the house into the mixer even with it marked to do so, let alone just plugging it into the AUX IN. Some sound man absolutely would not, whatever anyone, any manual, or any markings say plug the house into your mixer.

back to it:
what do we have to decide on for firmware?

cycle verse hold,
right and left,
anything else?

I vote for two second hold
I vote for cue in left, master in right

Not sure how you would switch it on, you would have to sacrifise a button (channel reverse maybe).
You would set an option in the 57 setup screen "use input 1 for house monitor". This would stop input 1 from ever being played through the master.

On the subject of split cue, I never actually use the split part of it, but I like the way it sums to mono. Definatley cue in left ear (the right ear on my phones is bust).

What about a cue group - use B1 to B4 to select the cue. PGM 1, PGM 2, Aux, Master.

Aux out doesn't have a mute, but it has a level control.

Excellent!

i like the 2-second hold.

cue left. master right. (like all the rest. and if you don't like it, turn your headphones around).

if we really ARE discussing this....why not make the left and right channels of the headphones selectable (for those of use DJs that use the headphone cue on the right ear). this way you could select any source and send it to either side of the headphones....complete cueing flexibility.

not a very good idea .... some headphones are really uncomfortable if worn the opposite way. Also if you are used to having the cord dangle on one left side, it will now be on the opposite side which can be a strange feeling to some.

Feniks .. you hit the nail on the head.

word

but I also like two seconds for ease.

then again, I imagine that I wont be switching it allot

:script:

As a right-ear-cue-er left-ear-main type of guy, I definitely support a complete cueing flexibility. Wearing your headphones backwards just doesn't work at all, but I have always liked the idea of a split cue, even though I haven't used it often.

AKIEM, thanks for the linky to add my $0.02 to this discussion.

word.

concerning R/L
If we cant get full flexibility, at least to start, can we use precident? the 24z, other mixers?

do we want to vote?

or just let Sam dictate?

VOTE

Viva la revolution!

Auto cue would be nice also.

let them eat cake ;)

I like cake...

hey can that cake be all black and red frosting?

i'll be honest. finding out that the 57 didn't have split cue until a few weeks before it was released was kind of disconcerting. i guess i had really liked that feature as i've used an empath for 2 years or so. i'm no stranger to pgm1-pgm2 cuing having had a 56 for two years and an 05pro before that. but i sometime play in environments that are not the best for monitoring. often times i used exclusively the split cut to make it through the night.
i'm certainly getting used to it, and have been playing out several times a week with it for about a month. thankfully i always use the booth out to control my monitor volume, but i've found i'm one-earing and cranking the monitors alot. not as good of a look. i'm eagerly awaiting a firmware update that might alleviate this issue.
other than that, no complaints. looping has really opened up some great new routines, and i really like the scroll wheels and joysticks. i still use my efx-500 for echo and i sometimes struggle to remember to depress the flex-efx before i drop a new track. but that's all on me.
thanks rane, serato, sam, et al.
-jimiscott

For me split cue is also essential. You do not need a monitor anymore. Have you ever played in an environment with bad monitors?
Its not good for your ears, as you automatically turn louder than necessary. With split cue you are totally independent from the monitors! Even those "bedroom DJs" have a good advantage with split cue: turn louder without disturbing your neighbour and safe the money for the home monitor!?
Mixing totally within your headphones is fun, sounds good, is healthier for your ears in noisy environments, and last not least safes time for putting your headphone on and off again and again.
Most DJs are used to have the monitor signal on one ear and the headphone-cue signal on the other ear, and from time to time on both ears. Why not doing this all within your headphone?
Because most mixers do not have split cue!
You have two ears and two headphone-shells, its only logic to send the sound to both of them independently.
Me I would never buy a mixer without split cue, and thus I am very disappointed not to see this amazing feature in the ttm57sl...

I'm not sure if this has been talked bout yet, but...

mann, i tried out the pioneer djm-400. I almost bought the mixer just for the cue function. It has an "auto" split cue. It has : ch.1 , ch.2, and master. If you have just the Master in, you hear the master in both ears. But, if you press ch.1 or ch.2 in, it makes it split cue. Its great because you never have to rely on outside monitoring. It was the easiest monitoring system ive ever used.

Maybe a little late but I vote yeah on this.

Jimi Scott and Mixjockey - fear not! This thread is about how split cue will work, not whether or not it should be added.

We have a design in mind, I want to present it to you, and I would like feedback on two things:
1. will it work for you?
2. will it be simple enough to be obvious how to use it?

Before I start, I need to define some terms.

1. Battle Cue. Used on the 56, and on the 57. The headphone pan slider mixes between PGM 1 and PGM 2. It's just like you are monitoring the master out, and the pan slider is the cross fader.

2. Normal Cue. You select the "cue source", i.e. that which you wish to cue, to be on the left of the slider, and master is on the right. Similar to the Empath, when not in Split Cue mode

2. Split Cue. The cue source is on one ear, and the master is in the other ear. The pan slider controls the volume of both: in the middle, they are equal volume, on the left, you can only hear the cue source in your left ear, all the way to the right, you can only hear the master in your right ear. (we can talk about switching left and right later).

The design I am proposing will allow you to quickly switch between Battle Cue and Normal or Split Cue. That is, two options:
Option 1. Battle Cue
Option 2. Normal or Split Cue

The surface of the mixer will look like this:
scratchlive.net
(excuse the rough photoshop)

In addition, there will be a new group, dedicated to Cue configuration. The objective here is that you go into this group once, to set up how you want cueing to work, and they you can drive everything from the slider and button in the image above. You may also want to return to this group if you wanted to cue something specific, or cue in a way that you don't normally cue.

The new group would look like: scratchlive.net

Imagine that all the button labels have a little headphone icon next to them to make it clear that each pertains to cueing.

So B1 to B4 select which source you cue. These would be with effects, if an effect was engaged on the channel.

Auto means use the cross fader to select which source to cue. When the cross fader is in the left half of its range, cue PGM 1. When the cross fader is in the right half of its range, cue PGM 2. It's a hard switch from one to the other as the cross fader passes through center.

Pressing B1, B2, B3 or B4 turns Auto off.

L/R means split cue. With this turned on, the left headphone plays the cued source, the right headphone plays the master, and the cue slider on the mixer pans - move it left and cue gets louder, master quieter. Move it right, and master gets louder, cue quieter. Basically, L/R lets you choose between Normal Cue and Split Cue as defined above. We might label it "Split" instead of L/R, but note that there will also be a R/L option for those of you who prefer it the other way.

To hear just the master output, turn off battle cue and move the cue slider to the right (or left if you have split cue on, and R/L selected)

Let me know what you think.

I'm not sure if it is necessary to have the fader control levels on split cue. It might be more useful if it did the same as it does in battle cue mode, so moving the fader from one side to the other would change which channel was being monitored in the PGM side of the headphones.

Also I assume that on auto, you mean when the fader is on the left cue PGM 2 (not PGM 1) and vice versa.

WOW!!! That would be dope! I like the "fader control levels on the split cue"

Nice sam...

so the master output level for the split cue would be pre-fader and at a set output regardless of the actual master level?

am i understanding you correctly if i say that we can use Auto + L/R simultaneously?

hmm...

sound's like you've been working hard on this Sam :)

so in normal cue + split cue mode do you have to go into the cue group to select what channel is to be cue'd unless you have auto mode on?

also in auto mode...where does the switch take place? i.e. in the centre on the cross fader?

reading this think the normal cue + auto mode would be the setting I'd use,as I'm not sure if I'd like split cue (with slider & master only) only coming out one ear on the headphones?

but never used split cue so that may change once I play around with it.

forget this question just re-read the auto section spec and it describes it there...

I am with nobspangle on this one.

I'm kinda with this too as it would mean not doing anything with the cue group for selection, only thing is how would you be able to have master only with this?

as I use the master only alot if there are no monitors?

I like this idea for how split will work, and I am super happy that you are considering us backwards-listeners with the R/L option. Looks like there has been a lot of thought on this issue.

if the x-fader is left(ch1) and playing thru mains, then it cues pgm1(ch1)? isn't it supposed to be cueing the other channel? or am i misunderstanding this?

other than that, auto + L/R seems sweet. i do like having the option to adjust the volume levels of the master and channel in the headphones.

YOu are correct. This was explaines somewhere else before.

1. YES!
2. yes!

1.YES
2. Yep

Im all for it! Cant wait!

I was thinking about this again...

I'd like it still to be a toogle between Master out & cue, and you would select which cue mode to be used in the cue group between the 3 options mentioned?

what does everyone else think?

Just haveing the split cue option and the l/r and r/l switch option is enough for me.

we'll still be able to use fx with split cue, right?

darn. i was at hopin we would have split cue with the small update. oh well. at least i know it's coming =)

I've been mixing for a while but I'm looking for a way to make less noise whilst practicing. Would a split cue mixer enable me to mix using headphones more, thus enabling me to keep the volume in the loudspeakers down?

Yes, with split cue you hear the master output in one ear and the cue in the other ear so you can mix without any speakers at all.

OK When is this coming out. I needed this bad at the Puma Store on saturday.

Before getting my 57 a few days ago, I have been using a strange little dj mixer called the KORG KAOSS mixer, basically a two channel mixer, with a crossfader and a built in KAOSS pad. Its cueing system is like this:

three buttons: ch1, ch2 and master

and if you hold down ch1 and ch2 simultaniously, you hear ch1 summed up in your left ear, and ch2 summed up in your right.

Very simple, and I have used this feature extensively.

I actually thought that this was "stereo cue", but apparently after reading this thread, stereo cue is a bit more comlicated :p

Anyone up for this simplified stereo cue?

p.s. maybe we just need to get some extra buttons and sliders onto the 57 :D

So will this come out? Are they working on it?
I won`t buy this mixer, if not. Would be nice to hear some official feedback

Bump. I really am looking forward to split cue.

my friends nieghbors want him to use split cue

Why am I still being ignored about adding 1 little addition that would make my world? It's what Stanton calls "Post," which is on my discontinued SA-12 mixer, and still on the SA.5?

The full explanation is here:

scratchlive.net

It's superior to Vestax/Ecler's "Scratch Cue," which I didn't realize before.

I just want to be able to hear scratches post-line fader, but with the effct of the cross-fader; I want to hear my scratches without the line-faders all the way up. What's the big deal?

I represent 590+ DJ's around the globe. Can I get some respect, please?

+1

So is this feature just going to come in the form of the 57SL or will lower end Rane mixers get this as well...

ONE MAIN reason why I stick with that Radio Shack mixer is because the SPLIT CUE was WAYYYYY before it's time.

What's the word Rane?

If you really need split cue, then get creative:

www.zzounds.com

Just do it yourself instead of waiting for Rane to implement it.

Man, that won't do me any good, because the output is COMBINED. It would be different if was a a THRU-PASS.

Besides, I don't get it, they had it on previous club style mixers, right?

Use your head homie, each channel has a left and right input... So take your headphone output on your mixer, and connect it to one of the left inputs on the minimixer. Then take the auxilary output on your mixer, and connect it to one of the right inputs. There you have it, split cue. Not that difficult.

I gotta admit, I am lazy and cheap, and would rather wait for Rane/Serato to hit me with a firmware update.

But I am excited about when it will be available.

ILK! I see what you're saying.....hmmm.....

Right? Works great for me. Plus you have indepent volume controls for each side. I can't live without split cue so this was my solution. It's pretty cool that they could add this function though after making the mixer. Hope they get it done so I don't have to set-up this extra piece of hardware. It says $75 on the website, but I got mine for $50 on eBay.

that is freakin clever

RiceCube, you should post that in the Tips

I'm too lazy, ya'll feel free to post it.

You should have seen how I used to do split-cue before...it was so ghetto. I used to use one of those splitter Y-cables so I had the auxilary output on the right, and the headphone output on the left, but the auxilary output doesn't have enough power cuz it's a pre-amp signal so I used this Red-something mini-headphone amplifier but it ran on batteries. I use the Pioneer headphones with the mono-switch so anytime I accidentally hit that and my headphones went into mono, it would cross the power signals from the mixer and the headphone amp so it would create this really loud buzz/feedback in my headphones and I was scared I was going to blow my headphones up while wearing them. It was so ghetto. Using a mini-mixer like this thing is definitely the way to go if a mixer doesn't have split cue. I have really bad hearing now so I can't beatmatch if I don't have split cue cuz I can't hear the beats that well. Maybe that's why I like SSL's visual cueing system...hah hah.

RiceCube, you are truly a SPLIT CUE warrior. I might have to consider this...

But wait, did they say they could retro fit this into Rane's current mixers?

The only question I have is, when you take the signal from the AUX OUT, (I suppose you're going into a Y jack to make it mono), that might double back to my mixer, I think my MASTER OUT, and REC OUT are the same connections. And if I only use 1 channel of the REC OUT, the load on that channel might cause an imbalance in my overall output....

But that's a damn good suggestion.

No, what you do is you connect it like this.

Left headphone out to L1 on mini mixer
Right headphone out to L2 on mini mixer
Left aux out to R1 on mini mixer
Right aux out to R2 on mini mixer

That way the mini mixer will be summing your signals to mono, no nasty y-cables.

Thought about that but then you can't control the volume of the two different sources using the mini-mixer. You'd have to control the headphone volume using the volume controls on the output of the main mixer rather than adjusting the mini-mixer's volume knobs.

Yes, please!

Gotcha!

Hi all, hey I like what Sam has put forward but...
How about having Master one side, and cue the other with the pan slider selecting the cue source...

That's the only way you could do it on the sl57 since there are no cue select buttons for each channel. That slider is what you use to choose which channel to monitor.

Auto-select is the magic word. The side which is not on the crossfader's faders side will be cue'ed.

Both the 56 & 57 have "Auto-Select"?

No, neither has. The 57SL might get one. Read the previous posts from the moderators in this thread.

Ok, when you mentioned "Auto-Select", I thought you were talking as if the technology has already been implemented....

*****Leaves 56 right where it is....*****Waits for update to base model*****

Your right, it's how one would think it would work but... it looks as if it's going to be implemented differently...



Hence my Suggestion...

I dont want to start a flame war but skimming this made me laugh.... something i think all our mommas told us to do when were were young.. and we never thought it would work...

anyhow... I'm so used to learning how to mix when there were no split cues, or fader curves (sometimes no faders even) that I think i'm ok with it the way it is.... But if other folks see a need for it and its not hard to implement, go for it... just dont crowd up the program groups, it took me a while to memorize them and rock without the panel being visible. (so I can have the most real estate for the song library)...

thanks..

So is there any new timeline when we could see this for the 57, as i have one and i really really miss my split cue. thanks!

No, not yet sorry. The first priority is to sort the effects out.

I started this post to see if what I had in mind is what people wanted, looks like it's close. Now I have to find out if we can do it.

holy that's a fast response!! hopefully (fingers crossed). otherwise i would have to try that minimixer idea, but i really really hope that won't be the case. any eta on when you'll know if it's gonna happen at some point, thanks Darwin.

I swear, if you (Rane) updates the 56 with a split cue, I'll go out and buy it today....

I wasnt going to buy these mixers for that reason...no split cue. I hope I can get this option as well. Split cue is so nice to get tight mixes. Forget the effects rane...hook up the split cue!! You can do most effects with doubles and what you got in the mixer anyway.

I agree, I feel split cue is a far better want than effects! I've been using split cue for 16 years, and I miss it terribly and I don't want to go deaf from monitors! please please rane/serato guys, hook us up! thanks in advance!

-sam-

your in general seeming like you give a Flock are the exact reason why im selling my final scratch and pioneer 909 and getting this mixer, but i can not live without split cue... i agree this is more pressing than effects, i too learned like most on a battle mixer, but now playing in large venues and clubs and such i need to have control over what i hear... so to naswer your questions

1. yes
2. yes

asap... is there any expected date for this, i dont own this mixer yet and its whats keeping me from it...

If split-cue is the one thing that's keeping you from buying the mixer, then you're acting dumb. Figure a way around it until it's implemented. There's no reason not to buy the mixer cuz of some little issue that you could fix yourself.

www.zzounds.com

Yeah, I would go ahead and get this mixer regardless of split cue, but I would love to see split cue implemented (not dogging the workaround RiceCube, as I think that is a good idea, I just think that it actually being implemented within the mixer would be a more elegant solution).

I vote for it!
Forget the FX, I needsplit cue.....

All I want for Christmas is Split cue.....but for rizzle! DJ D

Hey, I'm in no way DUMB, I just feel like if I'm gonna spend HELLA DOLLARS on a mixer, it should AT LEAST have A SPLIT CUE FUNCTION, that is not only found on mixers that you can get for 40.00 bucks on ebay (REALISTIC), but also existed as an option on PREVIOUS RANE mixers. If you don't ask for it, you might not get it. I'm in no way phased by effects, I just used doubles, and create my own.

Thats what im saying! Why worry about effects when we can load doubles up and get all the effects we want from that? What kind of effects are they thinking of adding to the 57 now anyone know?

I'd like to see a vocoder for the mic.

bump

So what are the chances of getting this for the next update (1.7) I really really miss that feature from the Rane MP-24Z I used to use, but that's it otherwise....57 RULEZ!

It won't be in 1.7, I'm afraid.

Damnit!!!!!

=(

That is disappointing. I know of one sale you would get immediately if this implementation was imminent (not me, I already have mine).

1.8? :-) Since you can't say Yes, can you say 'maybe'. :-)

how about 1.7.1 or 1.7.2? =)

It seems that alot and I mean alot us want this feature. I would like to know honestly if it can be done ever and what sorta time frame, or I might go the way of jimmy-rigging it as previously mentioned, but only if it's never gonna happen, or not for quite some time. Either way, that's disappointing that it won't be in 1.7 :(

Sam said,

Pretty much anything is possible with the mixer including this, and it will be done.

think more people want key lock in SSL than split cue on the 57 so I guess they have to get that released before looking at split cue.

never used split cue so not a big feature for me anyway.

I'm with bob... I used/ use ghetto split cue... one ear on and one ear off the heaadphones

When you have a good monitor(s), ghetto split cue is what I prefer too.

Well I played in a club with a wicked load main system and great JBL monitors, but I'm so used to split cue that I miss it so so much!! It's the fact that I have to crank the monitor to overpower the mains as the DJ booth is located on a mezzanine and causes some seriously delays to affect using it as a reference. Anyhow, my point is, I could live without the key correction than split cue, however those are my main 2 wants, otherwise I'm as happy as I could be!! please please give a real ETA on the split cue otherwise I guess I've to invest some more $$$ and set-up my own split cue system.

PS - sorry for the continued posts, but I didn't realize just how much I loved and got acustom to using split cue for mp24 mixers, thanks DJ D!

Also, I don't like having to use monitors as much, as I find I'm practically deaf at the end of 3-4 hours of working. Whereas with split cue, I can use my headphones to isolate the main system at a much lower volume level and not have to crank the monitor and headphones to get my desired referrence volume. Then I just use the monitor as a reference when hearing he combined mix at a much lower volume :)

I have also played around with the headphone cueing system as is, but it's hard to even come close to getting a split cue sound. Thanks again for all the hardwork in this mixer and software, it's fricking amazing!! I pack my laptop, ext. HD and mixer into a backpack with like 4000 songs!! It's nuts!! I remember the days of hauling like 300-500 records in these 3' x 2' road cases and damn, that was like 100lbs! compared to my 10 now!! Anyhow thanks!

i agree... i like my hearing and split cue helps me protect it...

:script:

anyone hear if 1.8 has split cue?

Ok, so I had to make my own split cue system up as per ricecube's suggestion, however I used a another mini mixer I had sitting around. But I was surfing the forum and found a topic that said that SPLIT CUE was gonna be a originally on the mixer? I mean, what happened there :( Can someone from serato please give us all some kind of real ETA on this feature, or am I suck with my hockie split cue set-up for awhile or forever? Thanks D!

point to the thread

bump =)

and again...

one for the homies....wtf give us this feature rane! Give us split cue and effects and I will not ask for anything more.

I am still hoping for Split Cue.

me too

amen!

right on

why do u guys think split cue is so great? just learn to listen to 2 signals together, trains your ears better. so you can also mix without headphones if necessesairy ;)


I think its funny that someone chooses normal cue for the look of it???

Its great because it allows you to do a real 1 to 1 comparison between the program and the cue.

Its great because helps to eliminate problems with monitoring like, levels, delays, frequency, and feedback.

Its great because it lets work without loud speakers in environments where they cant be used for example, appartment, late nights, them headphone party things.


If you want to "train" then just turn it off. But when its time to perform, not practice, you want all your tools to work to your advantage, not against.


and Im not sure how normal cue helps you learn to mix without headphones?

Preach it AKIEM!!!